One Wank After Another

[coalcube]

A blank assignment is a funny thing, isn't it? When you have it, you don't appreciate it, and when you miss it, it's gone.

Wednesday 10 December: Default deadline (9pm UTC)
Wednesday 17 December: Assignment deadline (9pm UTC)
Wednesday 24 December: Main collection works reveals (9pm UTC)
Thursday 25 December: Madness collection works reveals (9pm UTC)
Thursday 1 January: Author reveals, end of event (9pm UTC)

Mini-Challenges:

Crueltide | Femslash Festivus | Yulebuilding | Three Turtle Doves | Two for One | Yuleporn  
Family Matters | Queering the Tide | Yuletide Madness Drabble Invitational | TransTide 
Chromatic Yuletide | Unconventionyule | Wrapping Paper | Babytide | MultiLingYule 

Yuletide Discord for Hippos & Exchanges After Dark for namespace drama 18+ discussion.

yuletide | yuletide_admin | yuletide_pinch_hits | App

2025 Collection | 2025 Madness | Tagset | Letters

Flat / Recent | Top-Level (Last) | FAQ | Search

 

Comments

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

If you have a strong chance of hating a story about the fandom and characters you requested without a long DNW list bracketing it, maybe you need to reconsider why you're trying to get some stranger on the internet to write for you instead of writing what you want to see for yourself.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

CYRT

Because that's what gift exchanges are for. I try my best to write the fic of their heart for my recip according to their preferences and vice versa. You get that that's the whole point of fic exchanges for a lot of people, right?

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

That’s one of those things where the modern Yuletide doesn’t really line up with Yuletide from 20 years ago. Like I remember early on there was a lot of “omg I thought I was the only one who wanted Jo and Laurie to end up together” type stuff, people excitedly rewriting favorite childhood canons, etc, but now that it’s more “fic for a fandom that gets little to no fic” I feel like the subversive element is mostly gone and I agree it’s awkward when people request a dark canon and DNW most of the canon elements. But it’s also one of those things I can’t really see more rules fixing, just modern exchange culture.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think those two things you're contrasting are in conflict, nor do I think one has given way to the other over time. There's still plenty of the former. And "little to no fic" is a weird way to describe Yuletide when a fandom can have more than 1k fic before filters and still eligible. SOME people use Yuletide to ask for fandoms with little to no fic, but lots of others don't.

Like, I just don't recognize the supposed trend you're describing.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

DC

TBH I still see '1k before filters' as little to no fic, and I assume CYRT meant more along the lines of the various megafandoms that still end up in the tagset by virtue of a technicality.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

Are you dumb? Why does anyone read anything instead of writing something themselves and re-reading it? Because it's always more satisfying to read someone else's story than recycle your own brain contents over and over.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

DC

Of course it's more satisfying to get gift fic commissioned to spec, but that doesn't actually mean it's reasonable to do so.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

I'd like you to find me one dnw list that is so limiting that it forces you to literally write a commission to spec. Go on. Just one.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

DA

Yeah honestly I'm very curious to see examples of requests where coalies think that the DNWs are too excessive or too limiting for Yuletide. So we aren't just all talking about hypotheticals.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

There was one posted a few pages back on this post. We had a huge fight about whether or not it was actually limiting, as you'd expect.

But it doesn't even have to be that long a list, there've been examples in previous years of people who dnw gen and dnw all unrequested ships for one particularly obvious one.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

There's someone in a fandom of mine who has a lot of DNWs that ban any mentions of prior sexual or romantic relationships, so everyone must be a complete virgin who has never had even a crush on anyone else, and these DNWs do apply to canonical relationships. It appears to apply to every character in the story, not just the requested characters, and they have also banned F/F and F/M, so no heterosexual married OCs briefly mentioned in the background of a crowd scene and no mentions of the character's parents. They appear to be attempting to use their DNWs to make their writer write them a fic where their ship is completely and totally obsessed with each other.

This is also a historical canon and they have DNW'd any modern AUs, but also any anachronisms, which was brought up more than once in their list, so that's also kind of tricky to make work. Not impossible, but tough, since it would be anachronistic for them to be totally fine with being gay without having any prior exposure to the concept that it was fine. Could maybe thread the needle on this, but it would require real thought. They don't seem to want a fic that's heavy on the historical homophobia either.

I could maybe make it work, except that one of the requested characters has been canonically previously married with kids. This is, in my opinion, pretty important to how they act in canon. The requester seems hung up on this point enough that I would worry that even if I made sure that there were no explicit or implicit references to this canonical relationship, the way that I would write that character might not be enough of a pure as the driven snow virgin for them.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

So you think the only two options are no DNWs at all and long lists of DNWs? Ok!

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

DC

I mean, in terms of functionality, yes, I don't think exchanges allowing DNWs but only some (or only a certain number) are really a good idea. Limiting the number will inevitably lead to broader DNWs which makes writing harder instead of easier (like, I love smut, but if I don't have enough DNWs to DNW kinks I hate, I will DNW smut altogether, which takes an entire genre away from my writer). And saying "you're only allowed to DNW things from this list: ...." is unfairly biased towards people who have common DNWs over people who might have a few, but uncommon DNWs - someone who DNWs noncon, MCD, violence and AUs will have a great time in this exchange, whereas someone who's fine with all archive warnings but DNWs spiders and clowns is not going to risk signing up.

So, yeah, you'd either have to go for the chaos model and say "no DNWs at all" (not my idea of a gift exchange but maybe a fun type of event) or allow whatever DNWs people have to make their exchange experience good.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

thatsbait.gif

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

This is phrased a little extremely, but you're not wrong. There are exchanges which support being very specific in your request, but Yuletide is intentionally designed to allow a lot of flexibility and I think a lot of of participants (and certainly their writers) could benefit from shifting to fandoms that are more bulletproof, rather than "I want this fandom but actually I only want shipfic of these two characters who have one conversation in canon and I also DNW any focus on the A-plot of the canon".

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

Nah. Not wanting the A plot of the canon you're requesting is a Yuletide staple.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

So is requesting Any when you really just want one blorbo, but that doesn't mean it's a good thing.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

Wtf?! They're at all not comparable.

Fanfic is all about saying "fuck canon!" so why on earth should not wanting anything about the A plot of the canon be wrong?!

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

Hard disagree. Yuletide is supposed to be about getting the beloved canons AND characters of your heart. If it wasn't about that, you'd only be allowed to nominate canons and 2003 Yuletide would have been a far different creature (it's never going to stop being funny that Harry Potter was eligible back then because of the rare pair rule). Now yeah, ODAO exists for a reason, you can prompt shipfic but not demand it, and if your DNWs try to box your writer in, the mods won't enforce them if they're unreasonable (like Aurae and her underage Star Wars smut she kept trying to make people write). But canon divergences, focuses on unseen/minor portions of canon, or coming up with a reason for why these two random characters are meant to be together are a time honored tradition that should almost never be that difficult to write 1000 words for if you're offering that canon.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

CYRT

But canon divergences, focuses on unseen/minor portions of canon, or coming up with a reason for why these two random characters are meant to be together are a time honored tradition that should almost never be that difficult to write 1000 words for if you're offering that canon.

I mean, it's telling that the word you're using is "difficult to write" because it's not exactly beating the commissioned fic allegations. What about what's fun to write? I never argued that these DNWs are impossible to fulfill, I just think that once you start DNWing this portion of canon and that, or this kind of protagonist characterization and that, or DNW: any ending for this VN canon other than this specific ending, or DNW: anything but fluff, it's easy to end up in a place where your DNWs read more like prompts that broke containment. They may not be impossible to fulfill but when you stack them up on top of each other, the creative space of what gift you can actually get is going to be pretty limited, so you better hope the author shares your id and is also hyped about those specific prompts! Otherwise you're getting dutyfic and that's just going to be a meh experience for both of you.

Somewhere along the line, having a request that leaves plenty of room for the assigned writer to find a direction that's actually fun for them to write got completely forgotten, and that's what gives it a vibe of commissioned fic mentality.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

DC

Otherwise you're getting dutyfic and that's just going to be a meh experience for both of you

If your ~dutyfic is a meh experience for the recip, that's pretty much the definition of a skill issue.

As a recip, I'd rather have "dutyfic" about something that I enjoy than enthusiastic and inspired fic about something I don't care for. And as an author, I'd rather write something my recip loves than write the thing that's fun for me because I can always write fic for myself on my own time outside of exchanges. If we all just write what we want to write anyway, we can skip the whole exchange thing and write our own stuff.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

DC

"I mean, it's telling that the word you're using is "difficult to write" because it's not exactly beating the commissioned fic allegations."

No, it means some writers are more talented than others and don't immediately throw their hands into the air in despair because the recipient asked for these incredibly common tropes when you wanted to write these other incredibly common tropes instead. You can write what you want on your own time. When you sign up for an exchange you are agreeing to try to write what your recipient is asking for. It might not be possible for you because they're DNWing their way into underage noncon or they are asking for cute hair-braiding fluff about two characters you have only ever seen as bitter enemies locked in a spiral of mutual genocide and destruction, and you have to go ODAO because you can't write their prompts. That happens. But balking at basic canon divergence? Astonished that someone wants pre or post canon that ignores the A plot of the canon? Coalie, is this your first day in fandom or something? That's not a commission. That's basic fic skills. If you don't have those, yes, it will be difficult for you to write but that's because you don't know what the fuck you're doing.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

CYRT

Oh, for fuck's sake, it's not "telling" that I think you probably shouldn't be writing in exchanges if you can't find a way to keep characters alive, write a divergence for a portion of canon, or not include a juggernaut pairing in your story. These are incredibly common things related to DNWs and I have no idea what you think people should be asking for if you think even these are beyond the pale (I mean, wanting only a certain ending is bog-standard for fandoms, especially video games). You are likely the only person that thinks that having more than a couple of DNWs and a prompt beyond "write me anything" is commissioning fic (also, to cut this off at the pass, I have exactly five DNWs and I give a variety of wide-ranging prompts/likes). And for the record, I will take "dutyfic" that contains at least some of my likes over someone's "inspired" work where I'm sure they had fun writing it (and that's about all I'll say in my comment on it).

I mean, I don't think anyone's arguing that DNWs can get granular sometimes, making a creator feel like they're threading a very fine needle, but again, it's "telling" that for all the pearl-clutching, you still haven't provided any concrete examples of someone who's completely made it impossible to write all but one thing for them.with their DNWs (besides the wanker I mentioned, who was rightfully called out for it and booted). Yeah, no amount of DNWs and details can ensure that you're going to be an id match nor should someone go around expecting someone to read their mind and give them the perfect gift, but most of us who create would like their recipient to enjoy what they get. I know I've written things that I felt were less satisfying to me as a writer solely because I knew my recipient would be thrilled getting it (and they were). It's not "commissioned fic" as you seem so eager to throw around, it's me wanting to make my recipient happy because at the end of the day, it's not about me, it's about them. Otherwise, as coalies pointed out, I could just go write fic on my own.

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

+100

Re: Unpopular Opinion Time

[(Anonymous)]

Hi, Aurae.