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2019

Coal All The Way

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+1

He's definitely not in the right crowd to be using that sort of terminology, but he's using terms that apply to himself. Let's not pretend like gay men referring to themselves or groups they belong to with that particular f-word is any sort of rare.

Code-switching is not a Brand New Thing to teenagers.

Honestly, it can be. Anyone who’s tried to get their students to not swear or talk about getting high in the classroom knows that.

They can get sent to detention for saying it. This guy gets "Ugh he's annoying" on anon memes he doesn't have to go to.

That assumes you actually believe detention and other forms of traditional, negative punishments to be effective.

That said, it’s no one’s job on Discord to socialize Elijah. You can be annoyed, unimpressed with his behavior, not want to deal with it, block him, vent. But an 18-year-old lacking social graces really isn’t surprising, and tends to be out of inexperience over malice.

It's also not a Brand New Thing to gay men, which is what cyrt was saying. Unless you're agreeing with them? It's common in both subgroups and therefore not the red flag that the person a few parents up seemed to think it is.

I’m also a gay man. Code-switching isn’t something that only happens between different groups, but between subcategories of the same group. I’m older, and I know that what the young kids are okay with is their business, but I don’t have to pretend to be okay with Elijah here the way I do over in namespace. Rather than comparing the f-word to the n-word, maybe think about how some folk like being “ya boy” or “my boy” and others respond to “boy” in any context as disrespectful because of their age group.

I also think Elijah being trans plays a part. IDK when they transitioned/came out, but I think that being in largely queer spaces or if they're in that "coming out" stage where you want to the biggest, most loudest [minority] possible after so much hiding is a very real phenomenon.

/cis person but who is multi-ethnic and definitely had a period when I was around various groups of "my people" where I would act more aggressively POC due to #freedomfinally when I was a teen

I’ve seen a really distinct difference in slang between gay men/trans women who lived through or were alive but closeted during the AIDS crisis and the f word is one of those where the usage completely differs. There’s a lot of older gay men/trans women in particular who wouldn’t want to hear it out of a young trans guy’s mouth.

Did he use that f-word, though? At The Other Place, someone said he’d actually used something milder, but discussion has already taken off.

da

Both ‘fruit’ and ‘f***ot’.

NA

I'm a 20-something queer woman and though I don't use f*g or similar myself, a shitton of queer men I know (mostly all cis gay/bi men) do use it, jokingly, to refer to themselves sometimes, especially on twitter or similar, almost as a kind of camp performance. Essentially none of them were alive in the 1980s, and those who were were tiny kids. (I've never really heard the 50-something gay men I know use it, but they're family friends I've also mostly only seen in mixed company and never heard them in full camp splendor, so who knows.) It's not at all uncommon as a camp jesting/almost a reclamation type thing among millennial queer men, in my experience, and I would not raise an eyebrow at a Gen Z queer man describing himself thusly, though obviously code switching, etc. mean it might not be appropriate in a mixed Discord server.

Did he delete the f***ot posts? I can see one instance of him calling a character a fruit and one instance of him referring to f*g bashing. And I don't remember ever seeing him use f***ot in the wild despite participating in many conversations with him.

fucking lol. he didn't delete the tboy posts so i doubt he deleted anything.

he's annoying enough on his own, why are people making shit up like he's using slurs every five seconds instead of focusing on his constant tmi overload. even the slurs he did use are dated like 12/1 to 12/3 and nothing after that wtf

No one's making shit up and no one said he's using slurs every five seconds. Have we got such a short memory that earlier this month is the distant past?

we're literally in a subthread where someone stated he used the full f-word despite him never having done so, in a larger subthread about him using the full f-word despite never having done so. that's making shit up.

ncyrt

He did, on at least one instance, very early on. Maybe he deleted, maybe shadow deleted; I have no receipts and I will not push the point, but it did happen.

NA

Sorry coalie, but considering all the points in this thread where people have tried to spin this worse (like the post about him victimizing LGBT people by using the word) and the lack of other things being deleted, I feel like justifying all this based on one coalie claim of something they remember from a month ago is suspect at best.

There's several of us who remember. It's not just one.

Do you remember the context of the conversation and are you sure you aren't remembering the "f*g bashing" comment wrong? If it was the Yuletide server then a mod deleting it would make sense, but I doubt shadow stepped in to delete the self directed use of a reclaimed slur on EAD, none of the other posts that were called out earlier (and in more detail) were deleted, and I can't find any instances of someone asking him not to use the word or anything that would logically lead to a self deletion during the conversation.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2019-12-28 16:38 (UTC) - Expand

Coalies can be annoyed about multiple things someone has done. That's our charter.

It seems like failing to code switch and blend isn't common on the Yuletide Discord/IRC/members comm even for the damn vets.

Talking about chronic illness? People who have been in chat for years still do it.

Badmouthing your assignment when it will be really easy to connect the dots once reveals happen? Will only get you chastised if a mod is around and people still do it every year.

Sharing all the TMI details of your life? You have to block some people because even after 10 years and aa whole platform change later, they still do it.

Whinging about lack of comments when we can all see you haven't commented on yours? Probably the most obvious example of things you OBVIOUSLY shouldn't do in Yuletide culture and yet it is the FREE SPACE on wanky Yulechat bingo cards.

I get that his brand of bad chat behavior is your pet peeve, but let's please not act like breaking all obvious societal norms or boundaries and not bothering strangers with your TMI starts or ends with this fucking Elijah kid. He likely saw how the regulars act and thought not bothering to blend was fine.

Well said.

I'll take 10 Elijah's over some of the 40+ y/o Yuletiders who haven't changed. At least there's hope for teenagers to grow out of it.

I can multitask and complain about other idiots in chat, too.

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